<p>P T R <a href="https://www.deccanherald.com/tags/p-t-r-palanivel-thiaga-rajan">Palanivel Thiaga Rajan</a>, a third generation lawmaker from an illustrious family in Madurai, made his political debut by winning the Madurai (Central) Assembly constituency in 2016. </p><p>He retained the seat in 2021 and was allotted the important Finance portfolio when DMK came back to power. </p>.Freebies or Targeted Welfare? PTR defends DMK's schemes.<p>The former top banker oversaw several reforms in the sector, released a White Paper on the state of finances and reduced the revenue deficit substantially by over Rs 30,000 crore during his two-year tenure. He is currently the IT minister and one of the most articulate in the DMK. </p><p>In an interview with <em>DH, </em>the minister, who is seeking re-election from Madurai (Central), spoke about the BJP’s double-engine sarkar pitch, Tamil Nadu’s overall development and the entry of actor Vijay into politics. <strong>Edited excerpts: </strong></p><p><strong> </strong></p><p><strong>Q: Chief Minister M K Stalin has projected the 2026 elections as Tamil Nadu versus NDA. Do you think it is justified? </strong></p><p><strong>A: </strong>I think the biggest issue is that the government now in its third term in New Delhi has started acting as if the mandate is for them to be rulers, rather than elected people. </p><p>Almost no bills go to parliamentary committees; they bring in the agenda overnight and enact it the next day, drawing on states’ rights by legislating into state subjects like cooperation. </p><p>They withhold funds extra- constitutionally, and extra-statutorily, and they also use the Governors to thwart the intent of the elected legislature and government. The National Education Policy 2020, which was not even legislated in Parliament, is being forced as the benchmark to adhere to. </p><p>It is beyond any reasonable human being's argument that there is a tendency to create a new emperor and an empire out of Delhi. They want to suppress everyone and they are the homogenisers. They want one country, one language, one country, one tax, one country, one election, one nation, and so on. </p><p>Therefore, the chief minister says this is about fighting to retain self-governance and some measure of autonomy for our state and identity of our culture. </p><p><strong> </strong></p><p><strong>Q: Prime Minister Narendra Modi says Tamil Nadu needs a double-engine sarkar. Your opinion. </strong></p><p><strong>A: </strong>If you allow them (BJP) and their coalition partners (AIADMK) to rule, they will do what they have done in other states, which is to eventually homogenise the state into a uniform pattern and erode its distinctiveness. </p><p>We care about distinctiveness because we are Tamil people and we want to retain our language, our culture, and our way of life. We also want to retain the communal harmony manifest here, which is clearly missing in the so-called double engine BJP-ruled states. </p><p>We want to keep the double-digit growth that we are seeing in Tamil Nadu that no double-engine state has been able to achieve. We want to keep the per capita income here that no double-engine states have been able to achieve. So, we want our way of life, our language, our culture, and the legacy of our forefathers to be preserved. </p> <p><strong>Q: Are you coming to say that Tamil Nadu does not need a double-engine sarkar?</strong></p><p><strong>A: </strong>A single engine is enough for Tamil Nadu because their (BJP’s) double engines are not producing what our single engine is producing. The double engines, with all the favouritism, money, conducive governors, and all kinds of support are not producing what the single engine is. </p><p>Let us take Gujarat and Tamil Nadu. Gujarat has benefited from a double engine like no other state. Its per-capita income, economic activity, and capital expenditure have grown phenomenally. But where are the people? </p><p>The school-graduate ratio is less than half of what it is in Tamil Nadu, the doctor-patient ratio is less than half of that in Tamil Nadu and the multi-dimensional poverty is six times higher than in Tamil Nadu. What is it that you are actually growing for? Who are you growing for? For a few elite, right? </p><p>We don't want that model. Our voters prefer single-engine sarkars as they have shown time and again, even at the cost of being treated unfairly and unconstitutionally by the Union Government in Delhi. </p><p><strong>Q: The current elections are being held at a time when the world is engulfed with the West Asia crisis. The Modi government has maintained that it has been successful in maintaining its supplies of LPG and other things. Do you agree with the stand or do you defer?</strong></p><p><strong>A: </strong>I don't want to talk where I'm not fully informed. Until now, there has been no visible panic around shortages of cooking gas or petrol and diesel so far, which might reflect better management, stronger refining capacity, or less rumour driven hysteria. But, globally, markets are worried this could turn into the worst energy crisis since the oil shocks of the 1970s.</p><p>It is a fact that the Modi government benefited from a major fall in crude oil prices after 2014, when global oil dropped from around USD 80 to 90 a barrel to roughly USD 20 to 40 dollars and stayed low for years. </p><p>Despite this, the retail price of petrol and diesel under Modi has been much higher than under the earlier UPA government under Dr Manmohan Singh, even though crude was cheaper. The Union government was effectively milking high taxes on fuel, which became a growing share of central revenue.</p><p>As a former market trader, my view is that the government should have used the low price years to build reserves and hedge supply. In hindsight, I feel India did not manage risk and supply chain planning well.</p><p>If the Union Government had stuck to its Constitutional role and not tried to do too much -- avoiding constant political interference, micromanaging states, and using controversial methods such as pliant governors -- it might have executed a smaller number of core functions, including energy security, far more effectively.</p><p><strong>Q: When Rs 10,000 was transferred to women in Bihar ahead of the elections, parties like the DMK opposed it. But now, the DMK government disbursed the monthly DBTs in advance and gave Rs 2,000 as special assistance. Isn’t this double standards?</strong></p><p><strong>A: </strong>There is a real difference between what the Union Government did in Bihar and what the DMK led Tamil Nadu government is doing now, even though both involve cash transfers around elections. </p><p>In Tamil Nadu, direct cash benefits to women and families have been part of a long standing welfare tradition. So the current Rs 3,000 advance and Rs 2,000 as special summer assistance is as an extension of an ongoing, targeted scheme, not a brand new pre poll gimmick.</p><p>By contrast, the Union government’s one time Rs 10,000 DBT to 75 lakh women in Bihar under a newly announced scheme, timed just before the elections, is more like a special case for a particular state. </p><p>As a former finance minister, I believe welfare should be targeted transfers to the poorest. </p><p><strong>Q: Both the DMK and the AIADMK have not shared power with allies in Tamil Nadu. But when you share power at the Centre, the Dravidian parties seek plum portfolios. What explains this position of the Dravidian parties? </strong></p><p><strong>A: </strong>The core tenant of our philosophy is Maanilathil Suyaatchi; Madhiyil Kootatchi (Autonomy in the state; Federalism at the Centre). It is the nature of the Constitution that states have very little power and the Union has all power. History has taught us that whenever there were coalition governments in Delhi, the economic, and social outcomes have been better. </p><p>To run effective governments at the scale of around 50 million people or even lower, it has turned out that regional party governments have been significantly effective. It is simply mathematics and structure of the administration. </p> <p><strong>Q: When the DMK was in opposition, the party made rising debt a major issue but in the last five years, the total debt has increased from Rs 5 lakh crore to Rs 10 lakh crore. How do you see this? </strong></p><p><strong>A: </strong>I said it then and I say it now: the absolute size of Tamil Nadu’s debt -- whether it was around Rs 5 lakh crore when the ADMK left power or about Rs 10 lakh crore now -- is not a meaningful measure by itself, because all monetary figures naturally rise over time due to inflation. </p><p>Instead, what matters is the debt relative to the state’s economy, namely the debt to GSDP ratio, and the share of revenue that goes to servicing interest payments.</p><p>Between 2003 and 2014, Tamil Nadu’s debt to GSDP ratio fell from about 28 per cent to 15.8 per cent, and interest as a share of revenue dropped from 22 per cent to 11 per cent, which was a period of strong fiscal consolidation. </p><p>After 2014 (when J Jayalalithaa was jailed), both ratios worsened: debt to GSDP rose toward 26–28 per cent, and interest to revenue climbed to around 19–20 per cent, especially during the COVID years. </p><p>During the two years as finance minister, I saw these ratios improve noticeably, and since then they have not deteriorated much further, though they have also not improved dramatically. </p><p>The real story lies in these ratios, not in the raw numbers, and the key challenge is to keep them under control while still funding welfare and growth oriented expenditure.</p> <p><strong>Q: What is your assessment of actor Vijay’s entry into politics? </strong></p><p><strong>A: </strong>I am one of those few people who doesn't watch many movies. So, I'm not able to gauge his actor role. But as a citizen of a democratic republic, and as somebody who believes in a functioning democracy being the best way of government, I welcome and encourage all entrants into the public debate and the public sphere. </p><p>If it is an actor, there is the added benefit that they will command a lot of attention and be able to draw people's engagement with the political process. </p><p>In that sense, I think, on the whole, for democracy it is a good thing. The more people participate, the better. The more options the people have, the better they will make informed choices to the best of their understanding.</p>
<p>P T R <a href="https://www.deccanherald.com/tags/p-t-r-palanivel-thiaga-rajan">Palanivel Thiaga Rajan</a>, a third generation lawmaker from an illustrious family in Madurai, made his political debut by winning the Madurai (Central) Assembly constituency in 2016. </p><p>He retained the seat in 2021 and was allotted the important Finance portfolio when DMK came back to power. </p>.Freebies or Targeted Welfare? PTR defends DMK's schemes.<p>The former top banker oversaw several reforms in the sector, released a White Paper on the state of finances and reduced the revenue deficit substantially by over Rs 30,000 crore during his two-year tenure. He is currently the IT minister and one of the most articulate in the DMK. </p><p>In an interview with <em>DH, </em>the minister, who is seeking re-election from Madurai (Central), spoke about the BJP’s double-engine sarkar pitch, Tamil Nadu’s overall development and the entry of actor Vijay into politics. <strong>Edited excerpts: </strong></p><p><strong> </strong></p><p><strong>Q: Chief Minister M K Stalin has projected the 2026 elections as Tamil Nadu versus NDA. Do you think it is justified? </strong></p><p><strong>A: </strong>I think the biggest issue is that the government now in its third term in New Delhi has started acting as if the mandate is for them to be rulers, rather than elected people. </p><p>Almost no bills go to parliamentary committees; they bring in the agenda overnight and enact it the next day, drawing on states’ rights by legislating into state subjects like cooperation. </p><p>They withhold funds extra- constitutionally, and extra-statutorily, and they also use the Governors to thwart the intent of the elected legislature and government. The National Education Policy 2020, which was not even legislated in Parliament, is being forced as the benchmark to adhere to. </p><p>It is beyond any reasonable human being's argument that there is a tendency to create a new emperor and an empire out of Delhi. They want to suppress everyone and they are the homogenisers. They want one country, one language, one country, one tax, one country, one election, one nation, and so on. </p><p>Therefore, the chief minister says this is about fighting to retain self-governance and some measure of autonomy for our state and identity of our culture. </p><p><strong> </strong></p><p><strong>Q: Prime Minister Narendra Modi says Tamil Nadu needs a double-engine sarkar. Your opinion. </strong></p><p><strong>A: </strong>If you allow them (BJP) and their coalition partners (AIADMK) to rule, they will do what they have done in other states, which is to eventually homogenise the state into a uniform pattern and erode its distinctiveness. </p><p>We care about distinctiveness because we are Tamil people and we want to retain our language, our culture, and our way of life. We also want to retain the communal harmony manifest here, which is clearly missing in the so-called double engine BJP-ruled states. </p><p>We want to keep the double-digit growth that we are seeing in Tamil Nadu that no double-engine state has been able to achieve. We want to keep the per capita income here that no double-engine states have been able to achieve. So, we want our way of life, our language, our culture, and the legacy of our forefathers to be preserved. </p> <p><strong>Q: Are you coming to say that Tamil Nadu does not need a double-engine sarkar?</strong></p><p><strong>A: </strong>A single engine is enough for Tamil Nadu because their (BJP’s) double engines are not producing what our single engine is producing. The double engines, with all the favouritism, money, conducive governors, and all kinds of support are not producing what the single engine is. </p><p>Let us take Gujarat and Tamil Nadu. Gujarat has benefited from a double engine like no other state. Its per-capita income, economic activity, and capital expenditure have grown phenomenally. But where are the people? </p><p>The school-graduate ratio is less than half of what it is in Tamil Nadu, the doctor-patient ratio is less than half of that in Tamil Nadu and the multi-dimensional poverty is six times higher than in Tamil Nadu. What is it that you are actually growing for? Who are you growing for? For a few elite, right? </p><p>We don't want that model. Our voters prefer single-engine sarkars as they have shown time and again, even at the cost of being treated unfairly and unconstitutionally by the Union Government in Delhi. </p><p><strong>Q: The current elections are being held at a time when the world is engulfed with the West Asia crisis. The Modi government has maintained that it has been successful in maintaining its supplies of LPG and other things. Do you agree with the stand or do you defer?</strong></p><p><strong>A: </strong>I don't want to talk where I'm not fully informed. Until now, there has been no visible panic around shortages of cooking gas or petrol and diesel so far, which might reflect better management, stronger refining capacity, or less rumour driven hysteria. But, globally, markets are worried this could turn into the worst energy crisis since the oil shocks of the 1970s.</p><p>It is a fact that the Modi government benefited from a major fall in crude oil prices after 2014, when global oil dropped from around USD 80 to 90 a barrel to roughly USD 20 to 40 dollars and stayed low for years. </p><p>Despite this, the retail price of petrol and diesel under Modi has been much higher than under the earlier UPA government under Dr Manmohan Singh, even though crude was cheaper. The Union government was effectively milking high taxes on fuel, which became a growing share of central revenue.</p><p>As a former market trader, my view is that the government should have used the low price years to build reserves and hedge supply. In hindsight, I feel India did not manage risk and supply chain planning well.</p><p>If the Union Government had stuck to its Constitutional role and not tried to do too much -- avoiding constant political interference, micromanaging states, and using controversial methods such as pliant governors -- it might have executed a smaller number of core functions, including energy security, far more effectively.</p><p><strong>Q: When Rs 10,000 was transferred to women in Bihar ahead of the elections, parties like the DMK opposed it. But now, the DMK government disbursed the monthly DBTs in advance and gave Rs 2,000 as special assistance. Isn’t this double standards?</strong></p><p><strong>A: </strong>There is a real difference between what the Union Government did in Bihar and what the DMK led Tamil Nadu government is doing now, even though both involve cash transfers around elections. </p><p>In Tamil Nadu, direct cash benefits to women and families have been part of a long standing welfare tradition. So the current Rs 3,000 advance and Rs 2,000 as special summer assistance is as an extension of an ongoing, targeted scheme, not a brand new pre poll gimmick.</p><p>By contrast, the Union government’s one time Rs 10,000 DBT to 75 lakh women in Bihar under a newly announced scheme, timed just before the elections, is more like a special case for a particular state. </p><p>As a former finance minister, I believe welfare should be targeted transfers to the poorest. </p><p><strong>Q: Both the DMK and the AIADMK have not shared power with allies in Tamil Nadu. But when you share power at the Centre, the Dravidian parties seek plum portfolios. What explains this position of the Dravidian parties? </strong></p><p><strong>A: </strong>The core tenant of our philosophy is Maanilathil Suyaatchi; Madhiyil Kootatchi (Autonomy in the state; Federalism at the Centre). It is the nature of the Constitution that states have very little power and the Union has all power. History has taught us that whenever there were coalition governments in Delhi, the economic, and social outcomes have been better. </p><p>To run effective governments at the scale of around 50 million people or even lower, it has turned out that regional party governments have been significantly effective. It is simply mathematics and structure of the administration. </p> <p><strong>Q: When the DMK was in opposition, the party made rising debt a major issue but in the last five years, the total debt has increased from Rs 5 lakh crore to Rs 10 lakh crore. How do you see this? </strong></p><p><strong>A: </strong>I said it then and I say it now: the absolute size of Tamil Nadu’s debt -- whether it was around Rs 5 lakh crore when the ADMK left power or about Rs 10 lakh crore now -- is not a meaningful measure by itself, because all monetary figures naturally rise over time due to inflation. </p><p>Instead, what matters is the debt relative to the state’s economy, namely the debt to GSDP ratio, and the share of revenue that goes to servicing interest payments.</p><p>Between 2003 and 2014, Tamil Nadu’s debt to GSDP ratio fell from about 28 per cent to 15.8 per cent, and interest as a share of revenue dropped from 22 per cent to 11 per cent, which was a period of strong fiscal consolidation. </p><p>After 2014 (when J Jayalalithaa was jailed), both ratios worsened: debt to GSDP rose toward 26–28 per cent, and interest to revenue climbed to around 19–20 per cent, especially during the COVID years. </p><p>During the two years as finance minister, I saw these ratios improve noticeably, and since then they have not deteriorated much further, though they have also not improved dramatically. </p><p>The real story lies in these ratios, not in the raw numbers, and the key challenge is to keep them under control while still funding welfare and growth oriented expenditure.</p> <p><strong>Q: What is your assessment of actor Vijay’s entry into politics? </strong></p><p><strong>A: </strong>I am one of those few people who doesn't watch many movies. So, I'm not able to gauge his actor role. But as a citizen of a democratic republic, and as somebody who believes in a functioning democracy being the best way of government, I welcome and encourage all entrants into the public debate and the public sphere. </p><p>If it is an actor, there is the added benefit that they will command a lot of attention and be able to draw people's engagement with the political process. </p><p>In that sense, I think, on the whole, for democracy it is a good thing. The more people participate, the better. The more options the people have, the better they will make informed choices to the best of their understanding.</p>