Learning from defeats

Interview : Former Manchester United boss Alex Ferguson on his journey and that burning desire to excel

Alex Ferguson spent 38 years managing football teams, most notably at Manchester United, where he won 49 trophies, among them 13 Premier League titles and two Champions League crowns. In an interview last week in New York, he discussed his career, a few of his contemporaries and the tyranny of fans’ expectations. Excerpts:

You’ve been out of the game as an active manager for a few years. Anything you miss, or anything you absolutely do not miss?

I miss the staff, and of course the dressing room I always miss, because that’s where you get the energy and the atmosphere. It’s always been fantastic at United. But the things you don’t miss are that the game is very serious in terms of the money that’s in the game and the pressure that coaches are under. I didn’t necessarily think I was ever under great pressure, but there’s a pressure. So that’s eliminated from your life. So you get up in the morning — I used to get up at 6 o’clock, head to the training ground. The first week I woke up at 6 and went to go to get out of bed and stopped — “I don’t need to do this.” And I went to breakfast with my wife. First time in 40-odd years.

When did you start to sense the growing influence of money in the game?

The television deals had a lot to do with that. I have no dispute over the top players getting the best salaries, because if they’re the guys that bring 75,000 people into Old Trafford, they deserve it. Tennis players, golfers, American football — they get paid more than the soccer players. The difference is that a lot of maybe average players are getting very well paid in the Premier League.
Was it hard to deal with that second group once the money came in?

You say: “Look, let’s be reasonable. You maybe could earn something better away from United, but will you win anything? Do you enjoy being here? Is this the right club for you?” Because apart from the prospect of winning, you’ve also got to look to the training ground, the family spirit. These are important issues, things you have to look forward to going to the workplace every day. Good people working with you. Treated the right way. So I think there’s a lot of value for anyone being at United. So when it comes to the negotiation, obviously with their agent, if he’s stupid, he probably wants to leave. But if he’s sensible and we can come to a reasonable agreement, then we can sign a new contract and he’s enjoying himself.

You’ve said you always learned more from failure. Why? You didn’t experience a whole lot of it.

I had enough. I was better after a defeat. I had a certain purpose about me and a desire to make sure it didn’t happen often. For instance, if you look at our record in the Premier division: We won it 13 times, but five other occasions we were second, and the following year we won it. In other words, the character of the club, the character we built in that dressing room, made sure that they understood what losing meant. They didn’t enjoy it. Neither did I. So we did something about it.

There was a time early in your career at United when the fans wanted you fired and there was talk it would happen. Could the Manchester United of today — or any another club of that stature — have stuck with you through those days in this era?

They can, if the people who run the club believe in the coach’s conviction, and the path he is taking them down. But you need a strong trust in the owners to back the manager in bad times, because the press are playing their part, even fans can play their part, and a lot of club directors could not withstand that.

You’ve just written a book about leadership. What do you think about the job FIFA is doing running the game you’ve devoted your life to?

Everyone in the world, we’re all supporters of the entity; we’ve lost confidence in what’s happened. We all welcome the investigation, and we all hope that the investigation gets the truth. That’s what we’re waiting on; it’s out of our hands now. You hope the right people are doing the investigation, and you hope they get to the root of it.

You had a brief tenure in international soccer, coaching Scotland at the 1986 World Cup after the death of your mentor, Jock Stein, but you went right back to club soccer and the week-to-week managing of a team. Are some managers better suited to the international game?

I loved Jock Stein; he was a great mentor to me. And he was the right age to be a manager, 62. I think to manage a national team, you need someone who’s completed a course in club management. In other words, he’s achieved everything he’s wanted to achieve in club football. You need that experience to be able to sit in your house and do nothing for three or four weeks. That’s what it is. And for a young manager to take it? Very difficult, because he wants to be every day out on the field, coaching.

Quick impressions about a couple of managers in the news: What did you think of Liverpool’s signing of Jurgen Klopp?

I know Jurgen from his time at Dortmund. Very strong personality. Big, physical presence. Intelligent guy. Always looks like he’s got a strong control of things. Looks as if he won’t be messed about. So he fits the bill of a successful football club.

Did Chelsea’s fall this season under José Mourinho surprise you?

Oh, it surprised me. It surprised everyone. But I think good managers always find a solution. And I think he’ll be working on a solution. As anyone who’s been successful will tell you, when you hit that abyss, you have to get out of it. He’ll be sitting at home, sitting in his office, thinking, “What’s going on?” Because that’s what good people do. They find a way out of it.

When was the last time you went to a game for fun?

Last season. I went up to have dinner at Ronaldo’s house in Madrid. Took my son and grandson and we just went. I rung up Ronaldo and said, “Hope you’ve got three tickets for us.” He says, “Boss! Boss! Of course! Of course!” But I love that. I love going to these big games in Spain. When I was a young coach, and I used to travel and scout myself, Spanish football back in the ’70s and ’80s was more of a big event. You see these women all dressed as if they’re going to the opera. And the smell of the perfume, and the guys with the cigars smoking in the directors box. It was a fantastic atmosphere for a football game, an event. You’re going (inhales deeply), “Ohhhh, that’s fantastic.” It’s a different game today, because you have corporate boxes and things like that. It changes it a bit.